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What do you remember about your debut?
Jock Stein made me feel 10 feet tall before I went on to the pitch. He was great at that. He said 'Just do exactly what you do for your club, son', and that really helped me. The game itself was a big step up, though. The score was 2-0 to France but they absolutely destroyed us, it was 2-0 going on for 10-0. Platini was looking one way and passing it the other, they had guys like Tigana as well, they really were a great team. I said to Jock Stein after the game, I'm not good enough to play at this level. Jock said, 'Look son, you'll never play a better team than that', and he was probably right.
On top of all that, I was getting married the next day! I left straight after the game and flew back to Scotland in the early hours. Of course you can't sleep after your debut, and on top of that you're getting married the next day, so it wasn't a great night's rest.
Was Platini the best opponent you played against for Scotland?
Platini was terrific, and I would also mention Ruud Gullit at the European Championships in Sweden in 1992– he was the best direct opponent I faced for Scotland in my position. Rudi Voller was also a real handful but Platini was something else – I could never get near enough to kick him.
What was the highlight of your Scotland career?
I was fortunate enough to play in an era when we always seemed to qualify. I played in two World Cups [Mexico 86 and Italia 90], I played in the European Championships [Sweden 92], and they were all special, very big events. I played in a winning Scotland team against England at Hampden [in 1985] in my first Scotland v England game and it was something else to be part of that, having watched the game on TV as a kid. But I'd have to say it was probably my debut against France that sticks in the memory most. They were a great team, and you never forget your debut.
Italia 90 is a campaign that seems to hold a special place in the hearts of Scotland fans, from the low of the Costa Rica game to the ecstasy of the Sweden win, and then the late sickener against Brazil. Did we underestimate Costa Rica?
Yes, we did underestimate them. I don't really think we appreciated how good they were. We had no first hand experience of them and there was always a bit of the unknown in playing teams from that part of the world. Of course, we didn't play particularly well. Afterwards we got absolutely battered by the press, but then we got to the other end of the spectrum when we beat Sweden and suddenly we were heroes, it was always one or the other with the papers. Then we had a sharp kick in a sore place against Brazil.
On the pitch, did you notice how special the atmosphere was in the game against Sweden?
It was great but anytime I played for Scotland, there was always a great atmosphere. The Scotland fans make some racket and it always gave me a wee bit of a lift. I remember there were hordes of Scotland fans in Mexico, too. It didn't matter where we played, or who we were playing, the Scottish support was always fantastic.
Any other games that are particularly clear in the memory?
When we played Saudi Arabia away in 1988, the entire home support all prayed before the game. We were out on the pitch warming up and then the next thing you know the prayer mats are out – that was quite unusual. The heat at that game was also something else.
You played for Scotland at a time of great qualifying success for Scotland, but there were often rumours about divisions between the players based in England – the 'Anglos' – and the home-based players. Is there any truth in that?
I never really felt that it was 'them and us' with the Anglos, but there was that rumour. It's true that when I started playing, there was an 'Anglos' table at dinner and another table for players based in Scotland. I never really sat on the 'Anglos' table. I obviously knew the likes of Gordon Strachan, Willie Miller, Alex McLeish very well because I was playing against them regularly and Dundee United also had a good representation at the time.
But I have to say that the guys based in England were very friendly to me as a new player in the team. Kenny Dalglish went out of his way to make me feel welcome. He would say in the dressing room before the game, "just pass me the ball!" Graeme Souness had a real aura about him when he came into the room but forget the image he sometimes has, he was great to me and really looked after me when I came into the squad.
Which Scotland player did you enjoy playing with the most?
Davie Cooper. I really enjoyed playing with him. If I got the ball, I'd just give it to him. He was a tremendous talent. I liked Davie as a player, I liked him as a person.
You played 55 times for Scotland and have a place in the Hall of Fame. What does that mean to you?
To be honest, it's not something I think about a lot. My father speaks about it more often, it's an achievement for your family really. I just played the games as they came. It didn't matter to me so much, you start and then you get a gong for 25 caps, then you're near 50, and you know you're going to get there, but it just happens whilst you're getting on with playing the matches.
The Hall of Fame gives you a free ticket to every Scotland home international. Do you go to the games?
Yes, I didn't miss a home game for 10 or 11 years but that wasn't through my Hall of Fame ticket. I was involved with the under 21s so I would always get a ticket that way. In fact I've only ever needed to use my Hall of Fame ticket once, and that was to get my son in to the England game in 1999.
Do you see many ex-internationals at Scotland games?
It's good to meet up with other ex-players at the game but you don't see too many there, to be honest.
You also have a portrait hanging at Hampden. Have you ever seen it? Is it a good likeness?!
I've never seen it – I'm sorry to say I've never been to the museum. The kids have seen it though so it couldn't have been too bad, or they would have wound me up about it.
Who is your all-time favourite Scotland player?
That's an easy one because he's also my favourite player, full stop – Billy Bremner. I had an auntie in Doncaster when I was growing up and I used to go to Leeds where I could watch Billy play. You'll recall Leeds had not a bad team at that time. I was fortunate enough to meet him a few times later on. Part of it was because he was also a wee guy like me and he was doing well.
UNDER 21s
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You worked with James McFadden at Motherwell as a young player. What was he like to coach?
Faddy used to drive me bananas! I would spend my time drumming into him the importance of discipline, playing for the team and then he would get on to the park and run to every corner of the pitch just to get a touch of the ball. He would beat every man on the park about 15 times if he had the chance. But some of the things Faddy could do were amazing – he gave us something different and it's great to see him doing well.
Has the rule obliging SPL teams to include at least three under 21 players in their matchday squad had a positive or negative effect?
Both. There has been good and bad. The positive is that it has made all of the managers think more about their squad structure. Squads have had to be built. And it's given young Scottish players more of an opportunity. The negative is that some guys are sat on the bench and they have no earthly chance of getting on the park, not a chance in hell. The rule helped at the time, but I think it's past its sell-by date now.
There do seem to be more young Scottish players in the squads than in the 1990s…
That's right. From the early 90s there were players coming to Scotland from all over the place. At Dundee United they were coming in by train, plane and automobile from Honduras and all sorts of places. Everyone thought the best way to build a squad was to look at players from other countries. The trouble was that as soon as they didn't fancy it, they were off. There were far too many foreigners in the Scottish game at that time.
A few years ago there was a lot of criticism of the number of withdrawals from the Scotland under 21s. What is your take on that?
Yes, we went through a spell 5 or 6 years ago when where there were a lot of call offs and it was frustrating. There were certain players, from certain clubs, if there was a 'dodgy' game they wouldn't turn up. You could see why it was happening. They were at clubs where they didn't want to lose their place in the team, and maybe the managers were speaking to them. Others would say, well, that's me got a cap now, I'm an international player, and they thought they didn't need to do it again.
It's difficult with the under 21s, because you don't get the players together enough. You're trying to build a squad almost as you go along. It's no coincidence that we tend to start slowly in these campaigns and then we usually get some good results towards the end of the section.
What do you mean by players missing a 'dodgy' game?
For example when the game was meaningless because it was at the end of a campaign where we didn't qualify, or there was a lot of travelling involved. Some of the places where we went with the under 21s, the facilities were just unbelievable. But the 'no shows' did annoy me. After all, it would be nice if your squad could turn up…
On that note, the next Scotland game is an end-of -season friendly away to the Czech Republic. There will likely be a number of call-offs from the Scotland squad. Would we be better off avoiding games at this stage of the season?
Yes, there is an issue but I don't think we should scrap these games. George Burley needs to start making plans for the World Cup qualifiers and this is part of that. The problem is that at the end of the season, the players don't want to turn up. It's nearly June. The players will be thinking of their summer holidays. All the same, it's strange to me if players do not want to play for their country.
DUNDEE UNITED
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You reached the European Cup semi-final in 1983-84, and later the UEFA Cup final in 1986-87, and did well in other seasons too; Aberdeen won the Cup Winners' Cup in 1982-83 and reached the semi-final in 1983-84. Rangers and Celtic were not doing as well at the time, but had some good European results too. It has been difficult to replicate that period of sustained European success in Scottish football. Why is that?
Well of course a lot has changed, and there is now a massive financial gap between the Old Firm and the rest, so it's harder for Dundee United and Aberdeen. I think that stability was the key. Dundee United had a settled team and the club played in Europe for something like 17 or 18 years on the bounce. European football suited both us and I think Aberdeen as well, we were comfortable in possession and it suited our system. Europe was something we were almost blase about – we expected to be involved after Christmas, so much so that it was always a case of planning on buying the family Christmas presents abroad!
The team line-up was very stable over the course of several seasons …
Yes, the United team at that time had grown up together as a group. Paul Sturrock had been there from about 1974; Hamish [McAlpine] had been there since around 1924! When we won the league we only used around 14 players all season, although we had very few injuries that year. We grew up together. That United team were friends, as well as footballers. It's more difficult when your team is changing all the time. The players don't stick together long enough now to build the team. Of course, you could say that players were probably desperate to move around more then as well for the money, but they couldn't – the club could hold on to your registration, so there was less mobility.
The European Cup semi-final against Roma has become notorious for the gamesmanship of the Italian team in the second leg [United won 2-0 at Tannadice, but lost 3-0 in Italy]. What do you remember of it?
We were supposed to have an armed police guard at the hotel to stop any nonsense but the Roma fans stopped us from sleeping, making lots of noise outside the hotel all night. The bus was pelted with blood oranges and other things on the way to the stadium, and then it was the same again when we were warming up, all sorts of stuff was thrown at us. It was a tough game and of course there has been a lot said about whether the referee was 'got at' to favour Roma in the second leg. The Italians were also very wound up. A lot of it was whipped up by the Italian press, they were saying that Jim McLean had disrespected the Italian players in his press conference after the game at Tannadice. But after all that, I think we have to give credit to Roma because they played very well and we never turned up on the day.
SWINDON
You have steadied the ship at Swindon since joining them in January 2008. This is your first job in England – are there any differences between coaching and managing in Scotland and England?
No, it's the same coaching and managing, the skills are the same. The only real frustration I have had is that we've had so many games, I've not had the chance to do what I would call any 'proper' coaching with the team. I have only recently had my first clear midweek since joining the club in January. On the other hand, I enjoy the freshness about playing different teams every week. In England you don't play everyone about 25 times per season as we do in Scotland.
Do the players know anything about your career with Dundee United and Scotland?
There's a few that know me a bit better, like Craig Easton. Otherwise most of them know I played for Scotland, but very few have any idea I played in a European Cup Semi-Final and a UEFA Cup Final. But it's not about my playing career, it's about what I do now. I'm not one to go around talking up my own career!
Would you consider managing in Scotland again?
I was disappointed with the way it ended at Dundee United and the same with Motherwell. I enjoyed both, I knew United very well and Motherwell is a nice club. You can never say never with football, I would never say that I wouldn't go back to Scotland, but I'm very happy with Swindon. I've been given a chance to grow with a club following the takeover, and I'm enjoying it so far.
Do you have a specific target for next season with Swindon?
Just to finish higher up the table. We've comfortably secured our status this season after promotion last season. Everyone in the division hopes to get to the play offs or better and we're no different. Next year hopefully we'll have a right good season.
If you wish to use part or all all of this interview, please credit "Lunnainn Albannaich", the Tartan Army in London and abroad.
> loonyalba@loonyalba.com
